DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Dec 3, 2021 9:40:46 GMT -5
The difference is the general usage of the term high-end VS the specific usage of high-end audio that has been around for 40 years. All companies have their high-end products. High-end audio has a very specific meaning that I outlined.
So it's not a disagreement, it's boomzilla misunderstanding the term in the audio world.
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cawgijoe
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Post by cawgijoe on Dec 3, 2021 10:08:58 GMT -5
There are always diminishing returns.
I like audio products that are well built, use quality materials, nice design layout, more metal than plastic....products that are well thought out and built with quality components and materials that usually last longer.
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Post by audiobill on Dec 3, 2021 14:09:39 GMT -5
It’s like arguing that my Jaeger Le Coultre Reverso watch is no higher end than my Apple Watch because it keeps time no more accurately. Aesthetics usually cost, sometimes dearly.
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Dec 3, 2021 15:57:21 GMT -5
It’s like arguing that my Jager Le Coultre Reverso watch is no higher end than my Apple Watch because it keeps time no more accurately. Aesthetics usually cost, Exactly. A company's top of the line is not the same as the high-end. My Swatch likely keeps better time than my 18K Jorg Hysek. One is high end one is not. |
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Post by housetech on Dec 4, 2021 11:16:04 GMT -5
I remember Jaguar being "high end", but you couldn't give me one due to electrical problems... until Ford fixed it by redesigning.
btw- there's high end and high value, two different things
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Post by RichGuy on Dec 4, 2021 11:49:42 GMT -5
Exactly. A company's top of the line is not the same as the high-end. My Swatch likely keeps better time than my 18K Jorg Hysek. One is high end one is not. You mean that Deluxe Diamond Gloss paint job at Earl Scheib isn't a high-end paint job?? Has my TV been lying to me all these years? I know that 405x5 will say all paint jobs look the same, but I thought if I sprung for the Deluxe Diamond Gloss I'd be getting high-end! |
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Post by garbulky on Dec 4, 2021 13:52:01 GMT -5
Looks like there's high end, high performance, and high value. Yet what's preventing a high performance product from being considered high end especially if it performs equally or better than typical high end products.
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Post by housetech on Dec 4, 2021 13:59:04 GMT -5
LOL- High end is when you pay out the (rear end) for it.
There is a high end coffee made from some kind of wild cat that eat the beans, then process the "cat droppings", outrageously expensive, No Thx, you can have all you want.
I'll stick with Maxwell House- good to the last drop.
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DYohn
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Post by DYohn on Dec 4, 2021 14:03:01 GMT -5
Looks like there's high end, high performance, and high value. Yet what's preventing a high performance product from being considered high end especially if it performs equally or better than typical high end products. Like I said earlier: What makes (audio gear) high-end is exclusivity. This means it is a boutique product, often custom or hand-made, and yes usually more expensive than more mainstream products. It's an elitist product. It is a luxury product. It is not for everyone. It has very little to nothing to do with performance. |
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hemster
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...still listening... still watching
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Post by hemster on Dec 4, 2021 14:46:49 GMT -5
LOL- High end is when you pay out the (rear end) for it. There is a high end coffee made from some kind of wild cat that eat the beans, then process the "cat droppings", outrageously expensive, No Thx, you can have all you want. I'll stick with Maxwell House- good to the last drop. I have tried that Thai coffee. The beans are eaten by civet cats who poop them out and they're used for coffee. I was not blown away by the taste. It was decent but not what one might outrageously excellent. It is expensive but I bought half kilo just to try it. Now, I can easily waste bad coffee (and bad wine!). Life's too short for that. Just landed a great deal on Black Friday on a Nespresso Virtuo Deluxe and I can say the coffee is amazing. Average price is about $1 per cup. No more donations to Starbucks. |
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Post by housetech on Dec 4, 2021 15:16:08 GMT -5
Oh Hempster, what I would like to respond to that. lol
Thanks for clarifying.
Agree- Life's too short for not drinking what you like.
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 5, 2021 15:59:32 GMT -5
Looks like there's high end, high performance, and high value. Yet what's preventing a high performance product from being considered high end especially if it performs equally or better than typical high end products. Definition, apparently. |
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Post by audiobill on Dec 5, 2021 16:09:28 GMT -5
High end products are differentiated by possessing aspirational qualities. As I taught my son, what you want is the product at the end of the sentence “just as good as….”
And, how well is “rethinking the high end” working out?
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Post by rbk123 on Dec 5, 2021 17:45:47 GMT -5
And the battle of semantics goes round and round.
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ttocs
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Post by ttocs on Dec 5, 2021 18:13:58 GMT -5
I am reminded of a "conversation" I had with my older brother when we were in our early teens.
He asked me which drummer I thought is the best in the world. I replied Ringo Starr. He went nuts. I was laughing inside the whole time. Still am.
My contention was that Ringo was in the most popular, most famous and prolifically-saturated-with-hits band in the world. Why would their drummer not be the "best" in the world?
This is like that.
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Post by monkumonku on Dec 5, 2021 18:29:39 GMT -5
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Post by garbulky on Dec 5, 2021 22:08:23 GMT -5
High end products are differentiated by possessing aspirational qualities. As I taught my son, what you want is the product at the end of the sentence “just as good as….” And, how well is “rethinking the high end” working out? Well it was working really well for me. Back then I was interested in almost all of Emotiva's products. I saw some high end products at exorbitant prices from other companies. But I am more concerned with results. The ROI for results vs expenditure for the high end was just unrealistic for me. I see high end as "end-game" products. Ones people can buy and just sit back and be done with it. Yet I listened to some high end units, and I realized that I was not at all interested in them. Their performance and their price was lacking. In that way Emotiva's XPA-1 gen 2 amps fulfilled their purpose quite nicely. I still haven't heard a better amp. It's solidly built and fulfills every design feature I want from an amp. Like other Emo amps I've used show every sign of lasting a good long time. Couple that to an affordable price point, it made lots of sense. It was a winning formula that was well executed. Now though, I'm not convinced that Emotiva's representing a "rethinking high end" with their gen 3 amp models. I look at the line and I'm seeing examples of cost-cutting that I am not comfortable with. Plus we don't have a flagship two channel DAC or two channel preamp on sale right now. Their RMC-1 and XMC-2 hold promise, but I have been turned off with some missteps which have already been explored in detail. |
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Post by Boomzilla on Dec 9, 2021 22:49:30 GMT -5
…Emotiva's XPA-1 gen 2 amps…I still haven't heard a better amp… I (finally) have. The Starke Sound A2.640 bests the XPA-1,Gen. 2 amps in speed, detail, and imaging. Unfortunately, it costs almost $9,000. Not on my event horizon - but if I win the lottery… |
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Post by pedrocols on Dec 10, 2021 1:44:24 GMT -5
…Emotiva's XPA-1 gen 2 amps…I still haven't heard a better amp… I (finally) have. The Starke Sound A2.640 bests the XPA-1,Gen. 2 amps in speed, detail, and imaging. Unfortunately, it costs almost $9,000. Not on my event horizon - but if I win the lottery… Aluminum is pretty pricey these days for sure.  |
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Post by 405x5 on Dec 10, 2021 9:40:03 GMT -5
You mean that Deluxe Diamond Gloss paint job at Earl Scheib isn't a high-end paint job?? Has my TV been lying to me all these years? “I know that 405x5 will say all paint jobs look the same, but I thought if I sprung for the Deluxe Diamond Gloss I'd be getting high-end!” Seriously?! You don’t know anything about me sir. How do you come up with such a rag? |
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