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Post by leonski on Jan 22, 2024 21:01:34 GMT -5
You Bet!
Fly me to Adelaide for a month and we'll get it DONE!
I'll bring my golf clubs
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Post by thezone on Jan 22, 2024 21:13:39 GMT -5
E glass doesn't do much for VISIBLE light. But may help furnishings and such in the longer run. All my windows are the same....double glaze / eglass. And I'm in a mild climate area. The COLDEST it has been in the last month is about 35f (2c) with daytimes certainly in the 50s or 60s. Easy load for the heater! But pending a plan view of the room / house? That TV is in the WRONG place. And while north facing is nice.....certainly helpful....the huge Sky / Window exposure is simply wrong for serious viewing. My INSTINCT would be to place the TV at the darker end of the room and install motorized SHADES or electrochromic / photochromic glass......At least on the 2 windows immediately adjacent to the set. Congrats on a WONDERFUL VIEW. Please post some kind of Tele shot of the nearby city...... You SHOULD be fine for nighttime viewing. No question. Climate type for Adelaide? Csa, which is your basic Mediterranean ....... At the risk of hijacking this thread I have started my own thread on my impossible room. emotivalounge.proboards.com/thread/61151/impossible-ht-room?page=1&scrollTo=1121113 |
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Post by leonski on Jan 22, 2024 22:57:08 GMT -5
I'll go check it out.......with interest.......
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cawgijoe
Emo VIPs 
"When you come to a fork in the road, take it." - Yogi Berra
Posts: 5,033
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Post by cawgijoe on Jan 23, 2024 8:02:45 GMT -5
The amount of people falling for the SVS hype isn't going to change the fact their products are overpriced and the company uses unicorn fairy dust in their advertising regarding product performance. 'Hate and opinion' is a typical reaction in these instances of disbelief, it's ok. Yes, at one point they offered great value, but recently SVS has decided to double down on their reputation with their new pricing model. Marketing aside, the WMTMW design is a solid design and a separation from the traditional tower that Emotiva offers.
It's not hype. At least as far as their subwoofers are concerned (I've never heard their speakers), they are very well reviewed and widely considered some of the best in the industry on a cost/performance basis. Also, their customer support is among the best also and widely lauded among it's customers. While I might be slightly biased, my SVS sub has provided a decade of reliable performance without a single glitch and it's performance still impresses. Their speakers sound great too. |
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Post by Cogito on Jan 23, 2024 10:50:58 GMT -5
Cog? I'll agree on 2 of 3. I'm not big on flat black OR 'thumpy' enclosures. One of the big benefits of panels! But a stamped basket? Bad things can be influenced to the good by design and choice of materials.... I would not, for example, use most aluminim alloys except with very specific designs..... I'm fairly sure you CAN get away with a stamped basket. But I'd go so far as to 'forge' which results in higher density. It may even be possible to use a novel material. ($$$$) I'd start by researching the same composite used for the body of the new Aptera automobile. Formed in a gigantic PRESS which is large enough to do 20 or 30 large baskets at one go. Some Italian Company is making these parts. I'd NOT have speaker basket of anything magnetic and of thin gauge..... blog.miscospeakers.com/speaker-basket-materialsCAST Aluminum is widely used...... My issue with the stamped baskets is that the spars are so wide compared to most cast baskets, they reflect considerable sound back towards the cone (Easily identified with a waterfall plot) and unless properly damped, the stamped baskets can ring like crazy. Besides that, they are soooo 30's tech...  |
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Post by leonski on Jan 23, 2024 15:05:27 GMT -5
Ringing may depend in part on material and design. Aluminim tends not to ring. But also must be used in such a way to conform to the metals Zero fatigue resistance and perhaps other properties NOT as good as steel. In GENERAL, for any given set of properties you need MORE aluminum than the simple weight difference with steel would indicate. Stamping IS fast and cheap. I'd probably prefer CAST with design properties to max out rigidity and minimize resonance..... And Cog? You're a smart guy and I hope looking to the future. Please go check out the way the body for the new Aptera automobile (built here in San Diego) is formed in Italy in a HUGE PRESS. This press could be used, with the same type of material used FOR the car's body and make 20 or 30 at a time......It is a very large press. One possible advantage of using this technique is NO Magnetic or Conductive properties to the basket. Even Aluminum will flow current in a AC magnetic field. aptera.us/cpc-group-agreement/ |
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Post by audiosyndrome on Jan 23, 2024 15:53:06 GMT -5
Not sure about my 2.9s but NHT used plastic for the baskets in some of their designs. Pretty stiff I guess if ribbed properly.
Russ
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Post by leonski on Jan 23, 2024 17:50:21 GMT -5
Might be some kind of composite / injection molded.......?
Some of those materials are very tough and rigid.....
I have some acrylic around here someplace that I have THREADED using a tap.....that tough!
And YES, Audio, design is a big part of it.
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Post by Cogito on Jan 23, 2024 18:34:26 GMT -5
Ringing may depend in part on material and design. Aluminim tends not to ring. But also must be used in such a way to conform to the metals Zero fatigue resistance and perhaps other properties NOT as good as steel. In GENERAL, for any given set of properties you need MORE aluminum than the simple weight difference with steel would indicate. Stamping IS fast and cheap. I'd probably prefer CAST with design properties to max out rigidity and minimize resonance..... And Cog? You're a smart guy and I hope looking to the future. Please go check out the way the body for the new Aptera automobile (built here in San Diego) is formed in Italy in a HUGE PRESS. This press could be used, with the same type of material used FOR the car's body and make 20 or 30 at a time......It is a very large press. One possible advantage of using this technique is NO Magnetic or Conductive properties to the basket. Even Aluminum will flow current in a AC magnetic field. aptera.us/cpc-group-agreement/Glass filled polymers are commonly used in baskets nowadays. Much cheaper than metal, non-magnetic and are self-dampened. I have zero issues with them as long as they are mechanically stable. |
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Post by leonski on Jan 23, 2024 18:57:37 GMT -5
AH! Good information and pretty much along the lines I figured.
For prototyping, it MIGHT even be possible to 3-D print........
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Jan 24, 2024 15:57:52 GMT -5
Rigidity is a relative term... And toughness is a different thing altogether than stiffness... Yes, some of the new polymers are quite rigid, compared to the older ones... However I'm not sure how many of the ones that can be 3D printed compare to actual metal... (And what the materials involved, and the printers that can use them, cost.) And, while polymers can be great for prototyping, or for really small quantity production... Plain old stamped steel is often stronger, stiffer, and also cheaper (in quantities large enough to compensate for the high tooling cost). Might be some kind of composite / injection molded.......? Some of those materials are very tough and rigid..... I have some acrylic around here someplace that I have THREADED using a tap.....that tough! And YES, Audio, design is a big part of it. |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Jan 24, 2024 16:13:02 GMT -5
Any conductive material will allow eddy current to flow in a varying magnetic field. However, in a typical speaker driver, the magnetic field is concentrated in the magnet gap and voice coil structure. Therefore, in most situations, whether the basket will or could be affected by magnetic fields, or eddy currents, is a non-consideration. Thinks like printable plastic, and carbon fiber, work very well in small production runs, or where "custom forming" is required. In contrast, stamped steel, in the scale required for a car body, requires MAJOR tooling, and so carries major tooling costs. And there are some interesting limitations... which is why, for example, steel car body panels tend to be more flat rather than highly curved. This is one reason why fiberglas, and now carbon fiber, are highly favored for fancy/cool/futuristic aerodynamic designs. However I also notice that Aptera is still "taking reservations"(they moved production estimates from 2023 to 2024) It will be interesting to see if they can meet production goals... And how well their vehicles hold up on the road... or when they get into accidents... or if they catch fire... (they are electric hybrids so they have batteries). And, well, they are classified as a motorcycle... so NOT a car... (Don't get me wrong... they look cool... but I don't think I'd want to be the first one to own one...) Ringing may depend in part on material and design. Aluminim tends not to ring. But also must be used in such a way to conform to the metals Zero fatigue resistance and perhaps other properties NOT as good as steel. In GENERAL, for any given set of properties you need MORE aluminum than the simple weight difference with steel would indicate. Stamping IS fast and cheap. I'd probably prefer CAST with design properties to max out rigidity and minimize resonance..... And Cog? You're a smart guy and I hope looking to the future. Please go check out the way the body for the new Aptera automobile (built here in San Diego) is formed in Italy in a HUGE PRESS. This press could be used, with the same type of material used FOR the car's body and make 20 or 30 at a time......It is a very large press. One possible advantage of using this technique is NO Magnetic or Conductive properties to the basket. Even Aluminum will flow current in a AC magnetic field. aptera.us/cpc-group-agreement/ |
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Post by leonski on Jan 24, 2024 17:09:27 GMT -5
Any conductive material will allow eddy current to flow in a varying magnetic field. However, in a typical speaker driver, the magnetic field is concentrated in the magnet gap and voice coil structure. Therefore, in most situations, whether the basket will or could be affected by magnetic fields, or eddy currents, is a non-consideration. Thinks like printable plastic, and carbon fiber, work very well in small production runs, or where "custom forming" is required. In contrast, stamped steel, in the scale required for a car body, requires MAJOR tooling, and so carries major tooling costs. And there are some interesting limitations... which is why, for example, steel car body panels tend to be more flat rather than highly curved. This is one reason why fiberglas, and now carbon fiber, are highly favored for fancy/cool/futuristic aerodynamic designs. However I also notice that Aptera is still "taking reservations"(they moved production estimates from 2023 to 2024) It will be interesting to see if they can meet production goals... And how well their vehicles hold up on the road... or when they get into accidents... or if they catch fire... (they are electric hybrids so they have batteries). And, well, they are classified as a motorcycle... so NOT a car... (Don't get me wrong... they look cool... but I don't think I'd want to be the first one to own one...) Ringing may depend in part on material and design. Aluminim tends not to ring. But also must be used in such a way to conform to the metals Zero fatigue resistance and perhaps other properties NOT as good as steel. In GENERAL, for any given set of properties you need MORE aluminum than the simple weight difference with steel would indicate. Stamping IS fast and cheap. I'd probably prefer CAST with design properties to max out rigidity and minimize resonance..... And Cog? You're a smart guy and I hope looking to the future. Please go check out the way the body for the new Aptera automobile (built here in San Diego) is formed in Italy in a HUGE PRESS. This press could be used, with the same type of material used FOR the car's body and make 20 or 30 at a time......It is a very large press. One possible advantage of using this technique is NO Magnetic or Conductive properties to the basket. Even Aluminum will flow current in a AC magnetic field. aptera.us/cpc-group-agreement/APTERA is a paradigm changer. And designed for REPAIRABILITY. Guy across the street just went nuts changing bulbs in the nose of his Mercedes Van (used for business, mainly) Case in point is the 6 piece body. SIX....Not sixty and spot welded together. Note the motors IN the wheels. Entire wheel / tire dismounts with suspension using half a dozen fasteners. And I was just over this with a buddy. There are AT LEAST 6 major chemistries involving Lithium. Some are safer than others. At least one country I know is NOW making a submarine using Lithium batteries. If you think about it, you will have difficulty thinking of a WORSE place for afire....except maybe in a space ship In Orbit. I wasnt' thinking 'limited runs', but rather prototyping where a couple samples might be good enough for a go-no go decision on molding costs or 'other'.... And yes, stuff doesn't have to be magnetic to have a magnetic field! I demonstrated that in my 7th or 8th grade science fair project where I 'floated' aluminum rings. Got 'em to float AND had a permanent magnet where people could prove to themselves the material was NOT magnetic! I had to explain 'induction'.....And as it turns out I was VERY close to inventing the rail gun. If I put the ring down over the coil's core.....and extended the core to the upper limit......I could hit the power and the ring would fly UP a couple feet. A couple rounds of optimization and improving clearances? I could have shot something 30 or 40 feet or more......Add capacitors and such and you are golden...... ME? I'd like to be on the team who invents the FIRST large Planar Driver using Carbon Nano material in sheet form. It should be possible to IMPLANT the conductor in this sheet and snip it off to length with a pair of scissors. INCREDIBLE low mass and mechanical properties will make good use of even the now used 'refrigerator magnet' level technology of the rest..... |
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Post by Snoman on Feb 1, 2024 7:56:56 GMT -5
Any conductive material will allow eddy current to flow in a varying magnetic field. However, in a typical speaker driver, the magnetic field is concentrated in the magnet gap and voice coil structure. Therefore, in most situations, whether the basket will or could be affected by magnetic fields, or eddy currents, is a non-consideration. Thinks like printable plastic, and carbon fiber, work very well in small production runs, or where "custom forming" is required. In contrast, stamped steel, in the scale required for a car body, requires MAJOR tooling, and so carries major tooling costs. And there are some interesting limitations... which is why, for example, steel car body panels tend to be more flat rather than highly curved. This is one reason why fiberglas, and now carbon fiber, are highly favored for fancy/cool/futuristic aerodynamic designs. However I also notice that Aptera is still "taking reservations"(they moved production estimates from 2023 to 2024) It will be interesting to see if they can meet production goals... And how well their vehicles hold up on the road... or when they get into accidents... or if they catch fire... (they are electric hybrids so they have batteries). And, well, they are classified as a motorcycle... so NOT a car... (Don't get me wrong... they look cool... but I don't think I'd want to be the first one to own one...) APTERA is a paradigm changer. And designed for REPAIRABILITY. Guy across the street just went nuts changing bulbs in the nose of his Mercedes Van (used for business, mainly) Case in point is the 6 piece body. SIX....Not sixty and spot welded together. Note the motors IN the wheels. Entire wheel / tire dismounts with suspension using half a dozen fasteners. And I was just over this with a buddy. There are AT LEAST 6 major chemistries involving Lithium. Some are safer than others. At least one country I know is NOW making a submarine using Lithium batteries. If you think about it, you will have difficulty thinking of a WORSE place for afire....except maybe in a space ship In Orbit. I wasnt' thinking 'limited runs', but rather prototyping where a couple samples might be good enough for a go-no go decision on molding costs or 'other'.... And yes, stuff doesn't have to be magnetic to have a magnetic field! I demonstrated that in my 7th or 8th grade science fair project where I 'floated' aluminum rings. Got 'em to float AND had a permanent magnet where people could prove to themselves the material was NOT magnetic! I had to explain 'induction'.....And as it turns out I was VERY close to inventing the rail gun. If I put the ring down over the coil's core.....and extended the core to the upper limit......I could hit the power and the ring would fly UP a couple feet. A couple rounds of optimization and improving clearances? I could have shot something 30 or 40 feet or more......Add capacitors and such and you are golden...... ME? I'd like to be on the team who invents the FIRST large Planar Driver using Carbon Nano material in sheet form. It should be possible to IMPLANT the conductor in this sheet and snip it off to length with a pair of scissors. INCREDIBLE low mass and mechanical properties will make good use of even the now used 'refrigerator magnet' level technology of the rest.....
At what cost? Emotiva isn't inventing anything nor are they providing breaking tech at $1000 each. A couple hand held speakers (4"-8") will never see an audible difference, MSRP will double "for no reason" though. This isn't the speaker company you are looking for.
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Post by Snoman on Feb 1, 2024 8:01:14 GMT -5
More information on the new line of Airmotiv loudspeakers can be found in the latest video podcast below…
No new price increases, though there will be 10-25% sales throughout the year (not in video, historical)
3 towers; XT1/2/3; $1000/1400*/1900pr
3 centers; XC1/2/3; $400*/600/900
1 bookshelf; $500
1 atmos (identical to bookshelf with the cabinet angled): $400
*pricing never discussed, estimated
All speakers carry the standard Emotiva 5 year warranty, ship for free and use an AMT (which can be rotated!). All use the typical 5.25/6.5/8" mid-woof model, except the XT1/XC1 which carry a 4" mid-range. All towers carry a triple design woofer.
Dan is offering a discount to the first customer that purchases 3x XC3 centers to use for L/C/R and willing to send in photos for their marketing department. Email sales for more information
Dan stated details on the new speakers will be live no later than January 25th, including ordering information. Nick previously stated "probably 3 weeks", so these will all go live sometime between 1/24 and 2/3.
No other products or timetables for were discussed.
Without any fan fare, the new speakers went live over night. For some reason the products are buried at the bottom of the speaker page. Appears marketing never confirmed pricing with Dan and for some reason (surprise, price increase haha!). The X2 never arrived (out of stock) and is priced too close to the X1.
3 towers; XT1/2/3; $1000/1300/2000pr
3 centers; XC1/2/3; $400*/600/900
1 bookshelf; $500
1 atmos (identical to bookshelf with the cabinet angled): $400
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Post by leonski on Feb 1, 2024 15:16:30 GMT -5
APTERA is a paradigm changer. And designed for REPAIRABILITY. Guy across the street just went nuts changing bulbs in the nose of his Mercedes Van (used for business, mainly) Case in point is the 6 piece body. SIX....Not sixty and spot welded together. Note the motors IN the wheels. Entire wheel / tire dismounts with suspension using half a dozen fasteners. And I was just over this with a buddy. There are AT LEAST 6 major chemistries involving Lithium. Some are safer than others. At least one country I know is NOW making a submarine using Lithium batteries. If you think about it, you will have difficulty thinking of a WORSE place for afire....except maybe in a space ship In Orbit. I wasnt' thinking 'limited runs', but rather prototyping where a couple samples might be good enough for a go-no go decision on molding costs or 'other'.... And yes, stuff doesn't have to be magnetic to have a magnetic field! I demonstrated that in my 7th or 8th grade science fair project where I 'floated' aluminum rings. Got 'em to float AND had a permanent magnet where people could prove to themselves the material was NOT magnetic! I had to explain 'induction'.....And as it turns out I was VERY close to inventing the rail gun. If I put the ring down over the coil's core.....and extended the core to the upper limit......I could hit the power and the ring would fly UP a couple feet. A couple rounds of optimization and improving clearances? I could have shot something 30 or 40 feet or more......Add capacitors and such and you are golden...... ME? I'd like to be on the team who invents the FIRST large Planar Driver using Carbon Nano material in sheet form. It should be possible to IMPLANT the conductor in this sheet and snip it off to length with a pair of scissors. INCREDIBLE low mass and mechanical properties will make good use of even the now used 'refrigerator magnet' level technology of the rest.....
At what cost? Emotiva isn't inventing anything nor are they providing breaking tech at $1000 each. A couple hand held speakers (4"-8") will never see an audible difference, MSRP will double "for no reason" though. This isn't the speaker company you are looking for.
Yes, I agree. EMO buys drivers and such from SEAS or FOCAL or whoever. Heil AMT was at one time a little tougher to get...but not now. EMO's sole 'invention' is the voicing and fabrication of the speaker......I hope they use T-Nuts to secure the drivers, not wood screws..... I was just musing thru trying to figure out how to get a speaker in anything BUT black. BTW? Aptera, should you get curious.....will be inexpensive as such things go. But not a 4 passanger, Cross-Country vehicle... If you are ever in SoCal....let me know a couple weeks in Advance and I'll try to arrange a tour of their factory and facility just in the town next door.... |
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KeithL
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Post by KeithL on Feb 1, 2024 18:00:29 GMT -5
"Repairability" is always an interesting question... For example, having assemblies that can be easily replaced is good, as long as those assemblies remain available, and reasonably priced. A very long time ago one of the major TV manufacturers started using "works in a drawer"... And the idea was that, rather than repair a circuit board, you would simply pull out the old one and pop in a new one... However, it turned out that the replacements were expensive enough that, in the end, they were often pulled out and repaired... Presumably, a repair shop could quickly pop in a replacement, then leisurely repair the old one, and use it as a replacement part for the next TV they serviced. (But that would only be practical for models that were very common... or if the boards themselves would work in several models.) In the real world it will remain to be seen what Aptera charges for a "replacement wheel pod"... (Assuming that they remain in business and continue to make parts available for older models going forward.) And whether your insurance company will be willing to pay for it... And whether they'll want to charge you an obscene charge for "special insurance" to cover it... (Which will, of course, depend on what state you live in, which will determine whose insurance has to pay for that accident.) And, yes, there are several different technologies for lithium ion batteries... But you can be sure that there is a reason why Tesla uses the ones that DO catch fire... I'm pretty sure it has to do with cost and power density... (And, with a submarine, while safety is incredibly important, neither the weight, nor the cost, of the batteries is all that critical.) As a broad generalization new technologies tend to be expensive... and often have unexpected or unanticipated issues. This is why, while many new technologies become "mainstream", many simply end up fading away... When it comes to loudspeakers the simple reality is that cool new technologies tend to be extremely expensive... This means that, at least to begin with, they tend to show up first in a few expensive boutique products... And then, if they turn out to be especially effective, or the price comes down enough, they end up in "normal" products... However, because expensive speakers only tend to sell in small quantities, this process tends to take a while. (It doesn't matter how cheaply you can make that "revolutionary" new tweeter in "million quantities" if you can only sell a few dozen a year.) (And that goes double if it doesn't actually sound noticeably better than the "plain old version" that costs a lot less.) And sometimes that cycle is a real roller coaster ride... For example the original Heil Air-Motion Transformer worked pretty well... But they were clunky, expensive to make, and rather limited in application... Now, since the advent of both far more powerful magnets, and much better plastic films, they have become practical... (And, because those new relatively economical folded-ribbon tweeters work so well, it will take some doing for that new super wondrous dome to catch on... if ever.) Any conductive material will allow eddy current to flow in a varying magnetic field. However, in a typical speaker driver, the magnetic field is concentrated in the magnet gap and voice coil structure. Therefore, in most situations, whether the basket will or could be affected by magnetic fields, or eddy currents, is a non-consideration. Thinks like printable plastic, and carbon fiber, work very well in small production runs, or where "custom forming" is required. In contrast, stamped steel, in the scale required for a car body, requires MAJOR tooling, and so carries major tooling costs. And there are some interesting limitations... which is why, for example, steel car body panels tend to be more flat rather than highly curved. This is one reason why fiberglas, and now carbon fiber, are highly favored for fancy/cool/futuristic aerodynamic designs. However I also notice that Aptera is still "taking reservations"(they moved production estimates from 2023 to 2024) It will be interesting to see if they can meet production goals... And how well their vehicles hold up on the road... or when they get into accidents... or if they catch fire... (they are electric hybrids so they have batteries). And, well, they are classified as a motorcycle... so NOT a car... (Don't get me wrong... they look cool... but I don't think I'd want to be the first one to own one...) APTERA is a paradigm changer. And designed for REPAIRABILITY. Guy across the street just went nuts changing bulbs in the nose of his Mercedes Van (used for business, mainly) Case in point is the 6 piece body. SIX....Not sixty and spot welded together. Note the motors IN the wheels. Entire wheel / tire dismounts with suspension using half a dozen fasteners. And I was just over this with a buddy. There are AT LEAST 6 major chemistries involving Lithium. Some are safer than others. At least one country I know is NOW making a submarine using Lithium batteries. If you think about it, you will have difficulty thinking of a WORSE place for afire....except maybe in a space ship In Orbit. I wasnt' thinking 'limited runs', but rather prototyping where a couple samples might be good enough for a go-no go decision on molding costs or 'other'.... And yes, stuff doesn't have to be magnetic to have a magnetic field! I demonstrated that in my 7th or 8th grade science fair project where I 'floated' aluminum rings. Got 'em to float AND had a permanent magnet where people could prove to themselves the material was NOT magnetic! I had to explain 'induction'.....And as it turns out I was VERY close to inventing the rail gun. If I put the ring down over the coil's core.....and extended the core to the upper limit......I could hit the power and the ring would fly UP a couple feet. A couple rounds of optimization and improving clearances? I could have shot something 30 or 40 feet or more......Add capacitors and such and you are golden...... ME? I'd like to be on the team who invents the FIRST large Planar Driver using Carbon Nano material in sheet form. It should be possible to IMPLANT the conductor in this sheet and snip it off to length with a pair of scissors. INCREDIBLE low mass and mechanical properties will make good use of even the now used 'refrigerator magnet' level technology of the rest..... |
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Post by leonski on Feb 1, 2024 21:14:08 GMT -5
I do not know what the current labor rate is at an auto dealership. But just go in to change a tail lamp. You'll get it soon enough.
One of the main problems with autos is 'Book Rate' for a given repair. Honda wanted 250$ for sparkplugs for my Element. That is 35$ per plug and
than about 100$ for labor. Ridiculous. Real NGK plugs are 1/2 that at a real car parts store. They last 100,000 miles. Mine, pulled at 95,000 are
pristine.
You NEVER get billed for actual labor time. The way it seems to work it that mechanics get some kind of book rate than BEAT the time in the book to
fit more jobs in a given day. Decades ago, a buddy of mine, maybe 2 semesters from getting his A&P (Airframe and Powerplant) papers from the FAA
or whoever, decided to move following his idiot girlfriend and ended up at a Subaru dealer. He installed Air Cons for a start. Book time was like 5 hours,
IIRC, but the PROs with mucho experience could work it in half that. But the newbie? He was good and could to one in 3 hours and had trouble finding
that half hour he missed......But the purchaser was charged for 5 hours, even if it took 20 minutes.
So, repairability is 2 things. LABOR and the PART. Car dealers get a fortune for parts. And charge a premium for labor. One thing they DO have in
their favor is the specialty tools needed for some repairs. I've got a few out in the garage from when I owned a VW Beetle.....
Name a 'new' technology used in loudspeakers. Nothing new for 30 years, at least. Some new materials, maybe, but nothing NEW that has hit the mainstream.
Sure, I remember the Plasma Tweeter (dangerous darn thing) and I'm always leery of anything to do with Beryllium, which in some forms is toxic.
More powerful / better magnets don't count.
Those EMIT / Heil tweeters are maybe 40$ at retail.....Parts Express gets 35$ for one and Mundorf gets about 450$ each! Take THAT! EMO may buy 'em
in lots of 100 or even MORE as they seem committed to this part......for good reason...
And if you think Horns? Celestion makes some for Klipsch! Repair diaphragms are rarely >40$
Keith misses one point with the original AMT. They were Fragile. Didn't tolerate distortion well.
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Post by 26gary26 on Feb 2, 2024 16:56:07 GMT -5
I do not know what the current labor rate is at an auto dealership. But just go in to change a tail lamp. You'll get it soon enough. One of the main problems with autos is 'Book Rate' for a given repair. Honda wanted 250$ for sparkplugs for my Element. That is 35$ per plug and than about 100$ for labor. Ridiculous. Real NGK plugs are 1/2 that at a real car parts store. They last 100,000 miles. Mine, pulled at 95,000 are pristine. You NEVER get billed for actual labor time. The way it seems to work it that mechanics get some kind of book rate than BEAT the time in the book to fit more jobs in a given day. Decades ago, a buddy of mine, maybe 2 semesters from getting his A&P (Airframe and Powerplant) papers from the FAA or whoever, decided to move following his idiot girlfriend and ended up at a Subaru dealer. He installed Air Cons for a start. Book time was like 5 hours, IIRC, but the PROs with mucho experience could work it in half that. But the newbie? He was good and could to one in 3 hours and had trouble finding that half hour he missed......But the purchaser was charged for 5 hours, even if it took 20 minutes. So, repairability is 2 things. LABOR and the PART. Car dealers get a fortune for parts. And charge a premium for labor. One thing they DO have in their favor is the specialty tools needed for some repairs. I've got a few out in the garage from when I owned a VW Beetle..... Name a 'new' technology used in loudspeakers. Nothing new for 30 years, at least. Some new materials, maybe, but nothing NEW that has hit the mainstream. Sure, I remember the Plasma Tweeter (dangerous darn thing) and I'm always leery of anything to do with Beryllium, which in some forms is toxic. More powerful / better magnets don't count. Those EMIT / Heil tweeters are maybe 40$ at retail.....Parts Express gets 35$ for one and Mundorf gets about 450$ each! Take THAT! EMO may buy 'em in lots of 100 or even MORE as they seem committed to this part......for good reason... And if you think Horns? Celestion makes some for Klipsch! Repair diaphragms are rarely >40$ Keith misses one point with the original AMT. They were Fragile. Didn't tolerate distortion well. |
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Post by 26gary26 on Feb 2, 2024 17:04:44 GMT -5
Experienced the car dealer prices and labor standards myself. I am finding out that some mechanics at these dealerships are leaving them and going out on their own. They are even advertising where they worked before so you know what their certifications and specifications are for the cars they service. I have literally saved hundreds of dollars by seeking these mechanics out. Good luck with your search.
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